Policy-Discussion

["Alejandro Mery Pellegrini (CAcert)" <amery AT cacert.cl>]

2007/9/26, Iang 
<iang AT iang.org>:
> Alejandro Mery Pellegrini (CAcert) wrote:
> >> - In Spanish countries the surnames are a combination of the
> >> parents names, in some formula I never quite understood.  I
> >> suspect this can also have complications.
> >
> > It's pretty simple, it's not a combined surname, they are _two_ family
> > names, one representing the family of the father and one the family of
> > the mother. The child gets as first surname the first surname of his
> > father and as second surname the first name of his mother. In normal
> > life people only use the first family name (In my case just "Alejandro
> > Mery", but on legal documents you _write_ both.
>
>
> (slightly offtopic)
>
> What happens for the next generation?  E.g., when you become
> a parent, what single family name is then passed on to your
> child?  And, does the formula change for the mother?

The women don't change their names on marriage, that's not possible.
And people can only change their names when they prove on court that
their name is offensive.

on each generation the family names are kept separated, and the same
formula is applied each time. If the father has as surnames A0 A1, and
the mother B0 B1, every son/daughter will have as surnames A0 B0, and
if a woman of surnames A0 B0 marries a man with C0 D0 as surnames,
their children will be C0 A0. Father's first family name goes first,
mother's first family name goes next. Example. A woman may marry 5
times, each time having one child, and she will always keep her family
names, and each of her children will have a different first family
name but the same second family name.

On databases the "paternal surname" use a field and the "maternal
surname" use another, because each may include spaces like "del Rio"
(from the river)

We don't have "middle names" as we don't need such trick to identify
people because it's pretty rare to find two persons with the same name
and the same family names.

Additionally the first name it's usually not only one, the most common
is to have two names, and some old people may have three or even four.

In normal life people use only one of the "first names" followed by
the first surname (Alejandro Mery), in formal writing one adds the
second surname (Alejandro Mery Pellegrini) and in legal documents
every "first name" has to be included (Alejandro José Mery Pellegrini)
which is the case of the passport or id card.

In the case of CAcert assuring the surnames are not a problem because
you can simply add both on the field and everyone will be happy, but
not on the case of the first names. People usually hide their other
first names, and in many cases hate them. Also some families use the
same first "first name" for every child, but call them using the
second "first name", and they are known by the second "first name",
and they actually don't answer for their first "first name". And, btw,
their is no problem if you make a deposit on a bank using that "second
first name" and only your first surname, but when signing a contract
you shall use the "full one".


> Also, is this limited to Spanish speaking countries?  Does
> Portuguese naming also follow this style?

.pr/.br style is similar but not identical, they use the "maternal
surname" first, and the "paternal surname" next.


Cheers,
-- 
Alejandro Mery Pellegrini
CAcert Chile
http://cacert.cl